Positively surprised by call with Trump, Germany’s Scholz says

German Chancellor Olaf Scholz said he was positively surprised by his phone call with Donald Trump following the Republican’s reelection as U.S. president last week.

“That was — perhaps surprisingly — a very detailed and good conversation with the designated U.S. president,” Scholz said in an interview with Süddeutsche Zeitung published on Friday.

During the Nov. 10 call, they talked “at length about Ukraine,” Scholz said. While stressing that it would be “inappropriate” to disclose the details of their conversation, Scholz added that he got “the impression that he has a more differentiated position than is often assumed here.”

Scholz on Friday spoke on the phone with Russian President Vladimir Putin for about an hour in what constituted the first direct exchange between the two leaders in nearly two years, according to German media reports.

Asked in the Süddeutsche Zeitung interview if he’s afraid of a deal over Ukraine’s head between Trump and Putin, Scholz replied that “there was no indication of this in the conversation” with Trump.

In the interview, Scholz also stressed that Putin has not achieved his professed goals in invading Ukraine since Russia has not succeeded in conquering the entire country while NATO has gained two members, Finland and Sweden, and “is stronger than ever.”

When then asked why Putin should enter into negotiations as long as Russia is gaining ground militarily, Scholz replied that speculation about what’s going on in Putin’s head will get nowhere.

“We’ll have to find out — including by talking to him about it,” Scholz said.